VTV is a Liar, and the Pope is Catholic.

— UPDATE! I already issued an update and this post is only 2 hours old! See below —

Calling VTV a liar is like saying the sky is blue; we all already know it’s true and it’s a waste of breath saying it. There are some people still in TZM who think he’s a cool dude just because his radio show agrees with their ideology and he was a former administrator of the TZM Forums.

I’m just going to give you a quick taste of how dishonest this guy is, because it’s important for members of TZM still giving this guy resources to represent them to know how much damage he’s doing to their group. For full disclosure I haven’t been very nice to TZM in the public arena but consider this to be another olive branch I give to you when I say you need to walk away from this guy.

Now for those of you who haven’t been following the news, VTV is representing TZM in the Rick Ross forums. He is defending TZM from accusations of it being a cult. I went there and said I do not think it is a cult but needs to have an eye kept on as it in the future becomes smaller and more radicalized. I have always defended TZM not being a cult but have heed the warning that it’s somewhat close in many respects but mostly benign.

VTV is doing more than the lion share of the work convincing people that TZM is a cult. He’s used “us and them” language, he has demonstrated to the forum he’s willing to lie about the rules of the TZM forums, he has demonstrated that the group has ‘apostates’ and that they are demonized after leaving…etc. Most importantly he’s representing himself as some what of a leader and is blatantly lying and engaging in character assassination to this community of cult researchers. These people know the red flags of cults and VTV is waving them high and proud and I think it’s fucked up and it’s fucked up to TZM.

…but I digress.

VTV said something I will not even bother responding to on the thread there that is deliberately misleading. He’s tried twisting thing a while back, it failed then and I won’t even allow it to go though the same steps of fail again on the thread because it’s not the appropriate avenue for Mr. Ross’ forum. We’ve already shown that VTV has used this quote of mine (pun intended) to try and make it look like I’m saying Mario and Kush are intentionally dishonest.

He quotes me as saying: 

“I will admit this: I have seen Mario use very sensational and sometimes misleading titles for his videos and blogs. I have seen Kush publish information that turned out inaccurate when new evidence has surfaced. I can’t speak for the occult aspects of it as I am not well versed in occultism. (note: occult isn’t a cult)”

He omits the last sentence, and does so for a very important reason, because it’s a quote mine to make Kush and Mario look bad.

http://other.skepticproject.com/forum/3936/vtv-goes-where-even-cs-wont-he-exposes-merolas-parents/4/

I will admit this:
I have seen Mario use very sensational and sometimes misleading titles for his videos and blogs. I have seen Kush publish information that turned out inaccurate when new evidence has surfaced. I can’t speak for the occult aspects of it as I am not well versed in occultism. (note: occult isn’t a cult)
I can not say in good faith they are deliberately dishonest as you clearly are.

Because they aren’t dishonest and VTV is, that is what I was saying. Mario in the past has used sensational and misleading titles for his videos. SomethingSea1 made a video pointing this out and Mario went though all of his videos and re-titled them all, and he has been more careful since. Kush being wrong ex-post is not lying is what he was saying was true ex-ante. Would you call sports casters predicting a certain a team winning before the start of a game liars because the teams lost? No, nor should you expect Kush to have a crystal ball and be privy to all the facts in the universe. I was stating people make mistakes, VTV doesn’t make mistakes because he’s too busy intentionally lying.

I know this is where VTV was going because this isn’t the first time he’s tried to use this quote against me. Last time he failed miserably trying to show this as me admitting Kush and Mario are liars, but he can never admit he was mistaken because he’s a narcissist.

http://other.skepticproject.com/forum/3936/vtv-goes-where-even-cs-wont-he-exposes-merolas-parents/7/#post-39366

“And since there is no evidence to verify this yet we are expected to believe you. You are basically asking us to trust a known liar [you Neil] on his word.”
And you have yet to prove that I am a known liar at all.
Yet people here have already admitted that even they have seen that James Kush lies on his blog. 🙂

Anticultist was quick to call him on this lie:

“Yet people here have already admitted that even they have seen that James Kush lies on his blog. :)”
Noone said any such thing, what was said by jim jesus was that James Kush makes mistakes and then has to rectify it after evidence contrary to the initial posts surfaces.
Dont try and stretch peoples comments here into something they did not say.

VTV tries to affirm that he was not trying to twist my words and conveniently omits that last sentence to quote mine me.

Anti-cultist, this was said earlier by Jim Jesus:
“I will admit this:
I have seen Mario use very sensational and sometimes misleading titles for his videos and blogs. I have seen Kush publish information that turned out inaccurate when new evidence has surfaced. I can’t speak for the occult aspects of it as I am not well versed in occultism. (note: occult isn’t a cult)”
So yes, someone said such a thing. 🙂

And anticultist still refuses to buy into his lie.

You said someone said James Kush lies on his blog.
Noone said any such thing even that quote you just supplied doesnt say it, so the only person saying it here is you.

Then later he goes on to try misquoting anticultist as well which I won’t get into here. But this thread is an entertaining read. 

That’s pretty much it, VTV is trying to quote mine me at the Rick Ross Institute Forums to show that Kush is a liar. I didn’t say he’s a liar. Never hinted it, never insinuated it, never implied it. The only thing I was saying is that mistakes are made, but that doesn’t make them a liar like VTV.

———- UPDATE ————
VTV got so angry at the latest blogs exposing him by James Kush that he hopped on a proxy and posted as “LibertyGirl” then when he got called out, he stated pretending to be “Anonymous” and getting mad over ‘Zeitfags’ even though Anons have always called thing -fags for years. (i.e. Christfags, scifags, furfags, moralfags…etc)

LibertyGirl Comments:
http://zeitgeistmovements.wordpress.com/2012/07/13/neil-kiernan-stephensons-2009-attack-on-former-btp-national-chair-jim-davidson/
http://zeitgeistmovements.wordpress.com/2011/09/17/vtv-update/

“Anonymous”
http://zeitgeistmovements.wordpress.com/2011/10/01/new-label-problem-for-zeitgeist-movement-zeitfags/#comment-5815